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tonibunny
9th February 2007, 12:33 PM
Hi everyone,

I'm trying to find out if there are any other cases of Infantile Idiopathic Scoliosis with a double major curve around. Please could you all let me know if you hear of any? Apparently this curve type is unusual in Infantile Idiopathic scoli.

Cheers,

Toni xx

Sealy
10th February 2007, 04:07 PM
Hmmm.... that is interesting! I think Deshea's son Lucas had a double major curve ??? His curves are now at a manageable 19 & 13 degrees. :niceone: I'll ask her next time I e-mail her.

sg-ni
11th February 2007, 11:52 AM
Whats that mean in laymans terms? :???: , im still not too clued up on what these terms all mean :niceone:

If it is what I think it sounds like, S shaped?, it may be what i have had from age of 2.

Apologies if I am wrong :niceone:

Sealy
11th February 2007, 03:43 PM
Most infants have a C shaped curve and then the compensatory curve develops with time and it eventually becomes structural like the main curve. So....infants with double major curves is very rare from my understanding. :xdeer: ( Couldn't resist Rudolf :D )

tonibunny
11th February 2007, 06:26 PM
Yes, a double major curve is where there is an S-shaped curve, but one of them HASN'T developed as a compensatory curve to help keep the spine in balance as a result of the primary curve developing.

My spine has a double major curve; both the curves were already developed by the time I sat up for the first time, and the lumbar curve continued to progress even after I had the top one fused, but it was over 40 degrees to begin with so it probably would have done so anyway.

I've spoken to Deshea and I think that her son's curves appeared as the result of a tethered spinal cord rather than being truly idiopathic.

There's a good chance yours were double major too Steven, but it's more difficult to tell as you'd already have been sitting upright and walking for a while before you were first diagnosed. Do you know when your parents first noticed there was something wrong?

I guess I'm really looking for someone else who was diagnosed before or right after they began to sit upright, and who had no evidence of other anomalies. It's intriguing :D

sg-ni
11th February 2007, 07:44 PM
Ah, all I know is that i wasnt "sitting straight" when young and thats how it was first noticed, and from the xrays that I remember seeing, both curves looked to be of about the same size

tonibunny
11th February 2007, 07:58 PM
Could be, especially as your curves were around the same size - do you know how big they were when you were first diagnosed?

My mother first noticed mine when I sat up for the first time, too. She took me to the GP, who referred me to the local hospital, and the orthopaedic doctor there referred me on to Mr Edgar at Stanmore - I was SO lucky that that guy was clued-up enough to send me straight to the best scoliosis specialist there was :-)

sg-ni
12th February 2007, 06:07 PM
I have no idea what they were when I was first diagnosed, and no idea what they were as of my final appointment !, i really couldnt bare to look at my xrays to be honest, made my stomach turn lol

Yea its always good that you get a doctor who knows what he is on about !. My ma is adamant that without Dr Halliday, id probably have been operated on when young and he managed to control the curves so no surgery was required :niceone:

edit- just out of curiosity, do youve a percentage on how rare/uncommon this double major curve is?

tonibunny
12th February 2007, 08:16 PM
I haven't been able to find any statistics on infantile double major curves, but worked out that there are around 200 females in the UK today that had infantile idiopathic scoliosis that progressed....there'll be slightly more males, but I'm sure you'll be able to work it out....

Scoliosis occurs in 2-3 percent of the ppopulation

I will use the mean average, 2.5%

Infantile idiopathic scoliosis occurs in 2-3 percent of all scoliosis cases

I will use the mean average, 2.5%

Therefore infantile idiopathic scoliosis occurs in

(2.5 / 100) * 2.5 = 0.0625% of the population

55-60% of infantile idiopathic scoliosis occurs in boys therefore 40-45% of cases are girls

I will use the mean average, 42.5


(0.065 / 100) * 45.5 = 0.029575%

90% of cases of infantile idiopathic scoliosis spontaneously resolve
Therefore only 10% progress

(0.029575 / 100) * 10 = 0.002975% of the population

=3.36 in a million

So out of a population of 60 million there will be about 201 women in the UK today.

Given that we hardly know of any cases of progressive infantile idiopathic double curves, it's probably safe to say that these occur in fewer than 3 in 1 cases, which means that we're probably one in a million :joke:

Sealy
13th February 2007, 03:56 AM
Okay, I was intrigued by the subject and I did some reading on this. I apologize in advance if this becomes too technical. When scoliosis is first detected in infants, there is usually a single curve regardless of whether it's progressive or resolving, compensatory curves have not developed and when it does the primary curve will prove to be progressive. Even before it appears, a double major curve will have the distinguishing characteristic of a very low RVAD becoming negative over time. The reason why it's negative is because the angle between the rib and the apical vertebra on the convex side is greater than the concave side. An obliquity of the twelfth rib in double major curves is a reliable early sign when an infantile thoracic scoliosis is first recognized. Finally.... :thwack: double primary curves is not uncommon when the scoliosis is first recognized in the second and third year of life.

There will be a test on this, so be prepared! :-o

tonibunny
13th February 2007, 10:21 AM
That's interesting Sealy. How do I fit into that? I have no idea what my RVAD was....all I know is that I had a double major curve of about 62/40 at 6 months old, and that it was progressive with very little correction in casts or braces. The top curve went to the left and the bottom to the right. I also had a lot of rotation, and by the time I was ten my thoracic curve had twisted round more than 90 degrees so it was pushing my ribs out sharply underneath my armpit.

Do you know of any other cases of infantile scoliosis where a double major curve is present before the child sits up?

Sealy
13th February 2007, 12:46 PM
Toni,

There are *always* exceptions to the rule. Despite being a very unique case, you did extremely well. :squeeze: I will keep an eye out for double major curves before the age of one and report back.